Episode 102: Daniel Kelly

Hello magical friends, and welcome to episode 102 of WZRD Radio! I’m your hostwitch Bess and I hope you’re all keeping cool! Also, make sure you have a cake or other nice treat today.

Anyway, I’m sure you’re excited to hear from today’s guest, so let’s get started on that music! We’re kicking off today with Daniel Kelly’s “Mirror of Desire.”

~*~

That was “Mirror of Desire” by Daniel Kelly [lyrics], Animagi and a Werewolf singing “Become an Animal,” and “Allez les bleus” by Muggle Snuggle [lyrics].

And now, everyone say hi to Daniel Kelly!

Welcome to the show, Daniel Kelly! I am so excited to be talking with you today.

Daniel Kelly: Thank you very much, Bess. Uh, fabulous to be here, and congratulations on, on this is the 99th show, I believe?

Uh, this one I think will actually be, oh, math is hard. 102?

Daniel Kelly: Congratulations on, on almost a hundred then.

<laugh> Thank you. It’s a little bit hard to believe I’ve stuck with it this long. That’s an unusual thing for me to be doing.

Daniel Kelly: Yeah, I have, I have been listening some of –my kids and I drive to school and work in about an hour, so I’ve listened to a few, uh, a few of the shows. Um, there’s a diverse range of music out there in the wizard world.

There really is, and I’m always surprised by finding something new. It’s very cool that, uh, you’ve been listening. I hope none of it has been too inappropriate for your kids. <laugh>

Daniel Kelly: They’ve, they’ve been listening to, um, to murder ballads from the child collections since they were, they were two or three. So they’re, uh–

Oh, good.

Daniel Kelly: They’re pretty okay. Yeah.

Now you’re a little bit new to wizard rock. You, you were doing other music and then have sort of dip your toes in. How did that happen? How did you find us?

Daniel Kelly: So I, I’ve been doing music on YouTube, uh, since about, um, 2014 or a bit earlier, but in 2017, uh, someone introduced me to the filk community and then through the filk community. Um, uh, Karl-Johan is, is a, um, a person in the filk community and also in the wizard rock community. So he, he introduced me to the, to the wizard rock side. I’d, I’d already written, written some parodies with a Harry Potter theme before that. So it was, uh, interesting to see that there’s a lot of other people out there who, uh, enjoy their, their, uh, Harry Potter themed, uh, activities with music.

Do you remember how you introduced? What was the song or the, the musician?

Daniel Kelly: On my folk music journey started doing sea shanties. We had a, I live in, in Yass, it’s about three hours, uh, south of Sydney, but, a Sydney Sea Shanty Group came and uh, did a workshop. And, uh, it’s, it’s been fascinating in the, the Covid era to see young people going to pubs and singing, working songs of 1700s sailors. It’s good to get together and sing music. But because I was doing sea shanties, um, and also had a Harry Potter interest, I did one, uh, Harry Potter sea shanty, and then kept going. I ended up doing an album that I think ended up on one of the compilation of Harry Potter sea shanties about, um, maybe two or three years ago.

Yeah, I should have had it pulled up, but I, uh, I don’t… So a lot of people, when they do wizard eock, they create a wizard rock persona, which is how you get Harry and the Potters or Sonorus or, uh, Kalysta Flame. You did not choose to do that. Were you ever tempted?

Daniel Kelly: No, no. It was because I already performed as Daniel Kelly from a folk music and a filk perspective, people know the name, but I did, I did have a think about it before this, uh, this chat, and I kind of came to the conclusion that, um, Arthur Weasley is probably, probably the most similar character to me. So I’m, I’m, I’m a person who works in the government in uh middle management and, and have, uh, have five kids and, and, um, have a similar family life to the Weasleys. So that was, that was a fascinating, uh, realization last night. So I, I would probably be Another Weasley if I did, uh, did pick a wizard rock name.

That would be so fun. Are any of your kids musical? You could do like a, a Weasley family band.

Daniel Kelly: So I have tried to, um, encourage the, the kids to do music, but, um, like anything parents tell kids to do, it’s, it’s becomes uncool when they’re teenagers. Um, but my oldest, who are 21 this year have picked up music on their own a bit later in life. So, um, I still, still have a hope of a, of a, um, a family band.

Fingers crossed, we’ll get that on a Sampler one year. Now, you’d mentioned that you’d done some, some parodies, some filking, uh, and I think that was the first wizard rock song you did. Are they all filks or do you also do some original?

Daniel Kelly: So a lot of my filk music is original, so original lyrics and original, um, original melody. So it was, uh, was was lucky enough to be, to be brought to the US last year in October to go to the Ohio Valley Filk Festival and meet a bunch of people who I’d only met through Zoom calls and, and online filk circles for the three years beforehand. So it’s just like wizard rock, filk is a very diverse community of, um, of people that write original, original content in, in all different musical styles. And, and also obviously a very strong interest in parody. The big challenge with parody songs of in-copyright work is it’s very hard to, to safely publish that. Um, even if you’re willing to pay the royalties, um, the unique nature of parody is that you have to get permission to make the altered content. So that can be quite difficult.

So you’ve mentioned this, uh, filk fest and of course karl-Johan with whom most of wizard rock is familiar because he is such a good sport about Wizard Rock being a little standoffish.

Daniel Kelly: <laugh>.

At the the festival, do you think there’s a space for wizard rock? Do you think more of us should maybe give it a shot?

Daniel Kelly: Absolutely. The thing I noticed about the community was it’s, it’s so welcoming to all, all levels of musical skill and, um, and all diverse interests in, in the fandom. I guess the, the possible difference is that if you are hoping to commercialize wizard rock, where it’s, it’s me on the stage performing and audience, paying money to see me, that that doesn’t really mesh with the filk. Filk is very much a participatory activity, um, not so much a performance.

That’s interesting, because it is famously known that there is no money in wizard rock. You do it because you love it. Um, what makes it participatory? Is it like sing-alongs?

Daniel Kelly: Yeah, so, so one of the, the, the best memories of the, um, the festival was, um, Lauren Oxford singing Talis Kimberley’s song and, and the whole hundred people in the audience singing along loudly to, to “There Is Only Love.” So that, that’s the environment in the, in the big stage area. And then in the smaller rooms where they have, um, singing circles where everyone sort of goes around the circle and has a turn every time there’s a well known song, then mostly everyone else will be singing along with it. And I think especially post, post Covid people really appreciate the value of singing together in a group.

Ooh, that’s a, a fun transition. Uh, ’cause next question was about… I think this is my second interview with someone involved in wizard rock, uh, who’s in Australia, which is a little bit far from the general hub of wizard rock, you know, New England, America. How do you stay connected with your musical communities, you know, in particular wrock, but in general? Are they big in Australia?

Daniel Kelly: There’s probably five people that I have met in the filk community in Australia. We don’t have any, uh, filk focused conventions probably since, since the eighties, maybe maybe the nineties. And it’s also because it’s that participatory thing where it’s not people go to a, a Comic-Con or a, um, science fiction festival and expect to be entertained. It’s, it’s different when you’re expected to bring your instrument and join, join the circle and contribute a song. So that, uh, I still have a dream to to bring that back in Australia. But, um, in, in that, in the absence of that, it’s pretty much been Zoom, Zoom connectivity. When, um, COVID first hit and, and the festivals in the US couldn’t happen. And I, and I had been, uh, through my YouTube channel meet- meeting some filters. I did a, a concert set at one of those festivals, uh, around the time that I was doing my Harry Potter sea shanty album. So most of the content was the, the Harry Potter sea shanties. And, uh, and through that got to meet, um, a lot of people in the filk community and attend a few other online festivals. So the technology has really enabled, um, connection in a way that wasn’t possible before for people like me who live a long way away.

So is your idea of recreating this community where you are still just a dream? Or are there like plans, thoughts, developments?

Daniel Kelly: So between the, um, the five or six of us in Australia, some of who were in the filk community before me, and remember when there were cons in Australia, it’s, it’s still just an idea. I, I’m involved in our, our local Irish music festival here in Yass. So un understand how challenging it is to, to book venues and plan tickets and organize performers, and, um, it’s, uh, it’s a lot of work and that need for a strong community of volunteers who are willing to do all those hours of work are often unpaid. Um, I assume it’s the same for, for the, uh, Harry Potter themed cons in the US.

Yeah, that is the nature of conventions, a lot of passionate people doing it for no money and less sleep.

Daniel Kelly: I’d say it pays off though.

Oh, absolutely. I am organizing something here where I am, and it’s my first time trying to organize an event like this, and it’s scary and overwhelming, but I just keep imagining, you know, everybody coming, everyone having fun… Creating, you know, the space that I don’t have currently for my community.

Daniel Kelly: So the, the thing I noticed about the, the filk community is that, um, there’s an awful lot of people on the neurodivergent spectrum in that community, which can lead, lead to conflict. But the thing I noticed that people, people were getting on well at, um, the festival in Ohio, which was, uh, was fabulous, and, and people getting up on a stage or, or singing on their own in a circle, which was clearly a, a real challenge for them, but the community was welcoming enough for them to get up and do that. So that was, uh, was fabulous to see. But, um, are you, are you organizing with a committee or are you doing the work on your own?

Oh, by myself. It’s, it’s just gonna be a small concert, uh, this year. I have a friend working on, you know, a craft fair, but if it turns out, uh, maybe we’ll grow a bit in the future.

It’s time for a music break. First up we have Striking Down Diggory and “To Use a Love Potion.”

~*~

You just heard “To Use a Love Potion” by Striking Down Diggory [lyrics] and “La Complainte de Krum” from Les Kids des Etoilles [lyrics].

Let’s get back to that interview with Daniel Kelly!

So you do have, um, a variety of music on different subjects. What is it that appeals to you about wizard rock?

Daniel Kelly: For me, back before we had kids, one of my wife’s friends was a school teacher, so she introduced us to the Harry Potter book pro, probably 99, 2000. So before, before the movies and before the, um, the mainstream popularity. So for me growing up, the, the book that sort of filled that role was the Narnia Chronicles by CS Lewis. ’cause growing up in a fairly sheltered, um, conservative Christian household, that that was the gateway book to wizards and dragons and, and all that fantasy stuff. So when, when we had our kids, um, a couple of years later, Harry Potter was that for them. So it was, was very much tracking the, the later books as they came out and when, and getting them and reading the entire book in the, in the space of a couple of days, um, when the, when the series of books did come out.

And of course in have, uh, enjoyed the movies and, and follow on… And, and the, the thing about the series, I guess, is to tackle some really challenging issues and challenging issues that we’re globally facing at the moment in terms of the, the rise of, uh, Nazi ideologies and the, and the, um, desire to segregate people into different groups. And, and it’s, um, it’s definitely still relevant. So, uh, so because I’ve been interested in, uh, in the Harry Potter world in general, overlaying it with, uh, with music and filk seemed like a, a, uh, sensible thing to do.

And a lot of your wizard rock is very fun and follows sort of the folk tradition that it’s easy to pick up and sing along with. Uh, is that because you came to filk first?

Daniel Kelly: So I had some, I was on a work trip to Hawaii back in, um, 2003, I think, and, and couldn’t carry my guitar on the plane. So I bought a ukulele in Hawaii, as you do, and found that that instrument was, um, easy to travel with. So where whenever I travel, I try and find the local ukulele group. And the thing about those is like, like the filk community, they’re welcoming to people of all skill levels and, and it’s very much a singalong communal activity. So my second Harry Potter album, um, is all ukulele songs. Uh, to, to me kind of, uh, the, the amusing thing about, uh, folk music and filk, ’cause often you sing you sing very dark lyrics to a happy, um, upbeat song, which is something that I find quite interesting. When you’re playing the ukulele, the songs tend to be to be singalong type type songs. And similarly, sea shanties are inherently sing-along activity as well.

Aside from the ease of travel, do you have a preference between guitar and ukulele, especially for wizard rock and shanties and whatnot?

Daniel Kelly: My main, main instrument is, is probably guitar. Um, I, I did buy a guitar to take to Columbus about eight months before, but then I, then I did a few, a few gigs with it and, and decided I liked it too much to risk, um, having it smashed by American Airlines or one of those. So I’ve ended up buying the ukulele that’s, that’s on the wall here with me and take took that to Ohio, but the, the sound of a guitar is, is a little bit fuller. And, and if you, if you’re singing, um, serious sad ballads, it, it does sometimes require a, a guitar. But the thing about ukulele is that anyone, anyone can learn it. So I think we have about eight of them in the house and have tried several times to set up a ukulele group here in, um, the Yass Valley where I live.

For a brief period, there was a ukulele fund run by a wizard rocker named Snidget, where anyone who wanted a ukulele could, could just apply and, and get one.

Daniel Kelly: Yeah, you can, you can buy a, a reasonably functional ukulele, I guess, for, for 20-30 US dollars. Um, and if you’ve always wanted to learn to play an instrument, that’s probably the instrument to, to start off on.

Yeah, I think they are fairly prevalent in, I don’t know, I guess amateur music because it is smaller, easier to hold, I think fewer strings? That makes a lot of sense.

Daniel Kelly: And, and for a guitarist, because the four, the four strings are the four bottom strings of a guitar, you kind of already know how to play to, to play it when you, um, when you pick it up. There’s um, Benjamin, I can’t remember his, his last name sort of rose to internet fame with his no, No More F words To Give, um, ukulele song <laugh>. And uh, and I guess the thing, the thing about that, um, the Fringe music community is just, just like the, um, the podcast that you do. There’s, there’s people out there, um, getting the music to the, to the fans. Um, so in the filk community, there’s, uh, FilkCasts with, um, Eric and Lizzie, and there’s, there’s a lot of people that are, that are willing to spend time like, like you do to, uh, to get music to people. ’cause obviously the mainstream is, is not very likely to, um, to play that on commercial radio.

Yeah, when I read about, uh, wizard rock history, one of the biggest distributors was college radio. I don’t think we have quite so many of them anymore in this fandom, but hopefully we podcasts are, uh, helping continue to propagate.

Daniel Kelly: Yeah, it’s, um, it’s, it’s fabulous to, uh, to have… The world has changed in terms of, um, over the air television and over the air radio. The accessibility of, um, podcasts on your phone has, um, changed things significantly.

Well, we talked a lot about the, um, convenience of ukuleles, especially if you have some guitar experience, even if you don’t. Do you have any particular advice for new wizard rockers?

Daniel Kelly: I guess for me, the, the, um, the, the activity is a, is an alternate to, to working a day job. And so the main thing there for me is you have to enjoy it. So if, if you are, if you’re not enjoying it, then change what you’re doing or find, find people that inspire you and do things that you enjoy. Uh, and you, you’ll often find, um, the process of either singing in someone else’s song or trying to write a song, um, will, will be cathartic in ways that you didn’t realize it was gonna be.

A lot of the older school wizard rockers talk about how they processed a lot of emotions and confusion through the lens of Harry Potter. So the, the catharsis, I think, uh, plays back into that. Now, since you’ve listened, which is very kind of, you, you know, I like to get some solid technical advice in terms of tuning your instrument or I don’t know, picking a, a filk convention to attend.

Daniel Kelly: So, so for me, um, home studio recording has been a theme since I put my first YouTube video up. I think that was back in 2011 maybe. And the thing is that now, now that the technology you can buy is accessible to people in ways it wasn’t before. So, um, so it used, used to cost you a hundred thousand dollars or more to set up a, a proper studio with, with, um, recording gear and, and a, a, um, mixer and audio workstation. But now people can record themselves on their, on their phone and, and with a, with a bit of investment in learning how to do audio mixing and video editing. It’s something that’s accessible and, and there’s platforms to, to put content out on– obviously with the risk, if you put it out in the public, there’s gonna be some haters out there.
But, um, you, you can learn to ignore those and, um, you’ll find that, uh, your community will find you or, or you’ll find them relatively quickly. And, and again, coming back to that, um, you have to be enjoying what you’re doing. I sort of hear, hear a lot of, uh, discussion about sort of people on YouTube having burnout and, and becoming obsessed with seeking fame and money. If, if you, if you don’t go into it with, with that attitude and just be out there to, to meet people and make connections, then um, it could be a much better experience.

Did you have any particular avenues people should explore about learning the audio editing or, uh, setting up home studios?

Daniel Kelly: So, I dunno if it’s the same in the, um, the Harry Potter discord, the, wizard rock discord? But certainly in the filk discord, there’s a dedicated channel where, um, people of all skill levels talk, talk about those challenges of audio mixing and how do I record a particular instrument? And, um, and, and even even advice on songwriting and, and, and music writing. So, um, there’s, there’s so many people out there willing to share their expertise.

Where do we find the discord or what’s the best place, what’s the best entry point for wizard rockers going the other way?

Daniel Kelly: So pro, probably the Filkhaven Discord, which I can certainly provide a link to. So, because I’m, because I’m so old, I, I remember the, the nineties and Internet Relay Chat, which, which was a thing kind, kind of just after the bulletin boards were around in the eighties, and I was doing my undergrad engineering degree at the time, so probably wasted many hours and lost many grades um, sitting, sitting on Internet Relay Chat, speaking with people about, um, all, all matter of different things. Having come from that going to, to Discord, it’s, it’s almost exactly the same thing with the slightly prettier interface. So yeah, the Filkhaven Discord is, I think, I think came from some of the, um, the news groups and email lists of, of the eighties. Uh, and the fascinating thing is that some, some of the discussions that were had 20, 30 years ago are still up on the internet archive in those communities. So, so if you were interested in the origins of a particular filk song, you could often go back and find the, the writer of it in the eighties talking about it with other people.

I think, uh, your most recent, at least wizard rock was, uh, HuffGriffinClaw, the album? Came out earlier this year.

Daniel Kelly: Yes, yes. That, that was the, the most recent published one.

What are you working on now? What can we look forward to?

Daniel Kelly: Um, so, so my two most recent albums are not wizard rock. One is a series of, um, songs about America. Some serious, some humorous. Um, I, I watched Weird Al Yankovic’s take on the, on the presidential debate yesterday. And, and it’s just a, a very grim outlook. Um, not, not only for the US but for the world. And so some of those songs are, are trying and to find ways to, to, to reconnect those parts of, um, the American society that have been tending to enemies over the last, uh, eight or nine years. And the other album that I released last week was, um, a, a collection of Rudyard Kipling poems set to music. So, so I, I have a very diverse range of interest, and when, whenever a The Muse decides I’m gonna do something different, um, that’s where I, where I find myself. So those, those are the two most recent projects that I’ve been working on.

Anything coming up?

Daniel Kelly: I don’t know. I did, so I did write a song last night about, um, Arthur Weasley. ’cause um, prompted by that question of who’s, who’s, um, who’s the character you identify with in, in the, uh, the book series. And, uh, it was surprising to find how similar, how similar we are.

I think it was Creevey Crisis maybe? I’m so sorry, Russ. I keep pulling up your name. <laugh>, talking about how he could write love songs through Arthur Weasley to Molly for his wife, his wife. ’cause he felt the same, very similar, uh, family dynamics.

Daniel Kelly: Yes, yes.

I don’t think he’s been much explored by wizard rock.

Daniel Kelly: I’m sure there are people out there writing wizard themed Harry Potter theme songs that don’t even know that wizard rock exists or is a thing.

Every so often someone would be like, look at this TikTok or YouTube, and then we all go in and flood the comments. “One of us!”

Daniel Kelly:<laugh>.

“one of us!” are you gonna be traveling to any US conventions again?

Daniel Kelly: I don’t know. I think, I think that was a bit of a once in a lifetime opportunity to go to, um, to Ohio. I think it’s probably like 40 hours each way once you account for waiting in airports and changing flights. And it’s, uh, <laugh>. It’s a lot of, um, a lot of travel, but was absolutely worth it in, in, uh, in that situation. And, and still still hope that one day we’ll have a, um, a filk themed convention in Australia.

Here’s our final music break, starting with Tonks and the Aurors with “In Which Tonks Loses Her Cool.”

~*~

That was Tonks and the Aurors’ “In Which Tonks Loses Her Cool,” Nevilles and the Trevor singing “Memoirs of Neville,” and “SHRBT LMN” by MGNGL.

Here’s the last bit of my conversation with Daniel.

Thank you so much for talking with me today. Uh, I know I took us a little bit all over the map, but now we can bring it back to, uh, where WZRD listeners can find you and your music online.

Daniel Kelly: Uh, so, so YouTube, YouTube is the easiest way to interact, and I, and I put, um, very rough recordings up on YouTube. And the BandCamp site is best for, for finished albums. Again, a warning that I wrote on very diverse topics and not just wizard rock, but do, do have two themed wizard rock albums, and, um, a lot of folk music, a lot of sea shanties, a lot of, uh, a lot of folk music. And obviously like most people that use streaming services, they, they are very unhelpful to the artist. Whereas Bandcamp is, is fabulous in allowing both interaction with, with fans and, and also a reasonable cut of, uh, any money donated to, to artists.

If you heard a song today and you thought “I could listen to that again” then go to the transcript at WZRDRadioPod.com, follow the link and buy a copy of your very own. It’s the best way to support your favorite musician, and without our wizard rockers, we wouldn’t be here.

If you want discounts on WZRD merch, the inside scoop on everything that’s coming up, and bonus gifts and episodes, then you want WZRD Radio’s Patreon at Patreon.com/WZRDRadioPod. It’s just two muggle dollars a month and also supports the Community Wrock Fund, where we’re raising funds to help wizard rockers achieve their musical dreams.

If you want to keep up with WZRD between episodes, you can find me on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, and TikTok at WZRDRadioPod. If you don’t believe in social media, you can also comment on the transcript or email me at WZRDRadioPod@gmail.com.

And now, here’s Daniel Kelly!

Daniel Kelly: This song for some reason, didn’t make it onto the ukulele album because I’d forgotten that I’d written it. So, so I wrote this song when, uh, Robbie Coltrane passed away, that the character that played Hagrid. And I think many, many kids would’ve seen Hagrid as a, that adult figure that’s a little bit, a little bit of a child and trust- and can be trusted and, and has, has um affection for you rather, rather than the disciplinary, harsh demeanor of many other adults in the Harry Potter series. So, um, and I think Robbie did such a great job portraying the character. So I wrote, uh, I wrote this song for him.